Today on the exercise online session,someone sorry I’m hopeless with names.mentioned that they had plateaued and were no longer moving forward in their recovery,many so-called experts and doctors refer to this plateau but science has long debunked this so called plateau ’we’ the stroke survivor continue to improve long after the event.
Think of the brain as a field of grass,
This field used to be crisscrossed with many paths,the stroke causes the grass to grow into the paths but we need to trim the grass to open up the pathways again,someone on the call mentioned he’d been told something similar by a consultant:imagine stroke like a pile-up on a motorway and you have to navigate slip roads to get to your destination.
Stroke recovery can continue indefinitely and I view a plateau as just a stepping stone to moving onto the next stage of recovery. I guess it means different things to different people.
I tend to agree with @Mrs5K and do believe that in a way plateaus can occur.
However I see them as temporary resting points, perhaps necessary, where one gets the opportunity to consolidate gains. They become a solid foundation from which further progress can be made.
From what I have read the the thing that makes us what we are is in a constant cycle of change and renewal. Within a finite period every cell in our bodies has been eliminated and replaced. All of this is regulated from a pattern, perhaps DNA that prearranges and orders our whole being while we are the thing we call an individual human being.
In other words there is a corrective process which strives to repair and maintain a properly functioning organism.
I have a hazy notion of this process but I am old enough to have seen how old wounds and injuries are slowly righted and healed. This is a continuous process one that does not reach some state then stop.
Ideas like this are complex but are born from experience rather than conjecture. Theory can be useful but experience trumps it every time.
Runners, cyclists and all sorts of endurance athletes often talk about performance plateaus, where the body just needs to ease off a bit before the next block of training. Recovery from a stroke may look very different to training for a marathon, but it still involves pushing your body beyond its current limits and in many cases requires endurance and determination that would make an athlete weep. It would be surprising if there wasn’t the occasional plateau.
I do understand where the thought behind “plateauing”. My view is that yes, we may get to a point where progress in one area or direction is no longer happening, I see that as an indication that progress has been good and it’s time to change tack, perhaps focusing on a different aspect of recovery.
Plateaus may be rest or recharge periods for your bady and mind.
What they are not are end of recovery or points from which there can be no further recovery.
The only time when recovery ends is when you have fully recovered.
Until then you are in the continuous improvement process.
How fast or slow you recover depends.
When it comes to stroke, stroke recovery and all things stroke related, the medical profession is in its infancy.
The way I see it, stroke rehabilitation over time will see the journey having plateaus, inclines, declines, bends, swerves, corners, steps, drops, lifts, tilts, tumbles, turns, hikes, drifts, gains, stasis, and all manner of obstacles and challenges as we rehabilitate, age and exist through time and space.
I was, specifically, referring to the rehabilitation journey which may, indeed, mirror that of any life journey experienced by an anthropoid legume. In as much to say, a life does not only plateau at times but has many non-linear squiggles and blotches along one’s timespan.
I have to add that I don’t know what an average hummus been’s life may be, I assume something resembling a chickpea?
You are right @ManjiB but there is a medical misnomer perpetuated by so called experts that stroke recovery can and will come to a standstill,but I want to make sure everyone knows this has been debunked and as you say we,the stroke survivor are human beans and as such as with all aspects of life as others have said will improve,progress and evolve.the more you put in the more you will get out!For example I fought tooth-and-nail to eat again.eating and walking are inherently human and for 4-long years I’ve been deprived of these human facets,making me feel less than human,and severely impacting my mental health.stroke recovery is an uphill battle that so called experts don’t understand.once my cognition returned after the cranioplasty,placing an implant in my cranium,I should have been ‘allowed’ to eat and walk, but I was hobbled by those around me thanks to health and safety and I was kept alive rather than given a life!in short,4 years was stolen from me.i simply existed and failed to thrive because the system is about fear,fear of falling etc.but if we confined our children to a bed or wheelchair the way I was confined we would be deemed poor parents,as I mentioned in another post I’ve been reversed in time to a 14-month old toddler.but as the mother of 3 children I know how important it was to encourage and teach my children to walk and eat.yes they choked and fell over but that didn’t stop me supporting and teaching them,so why doesn’t the medical fraternity treat us the stroke survivor like regular human beans,instead we are on cotton wool and read the riot act if we try to return to our humanity.
I think all of us here have experienced them. In my experience the most substantial improvements were made after plateaus and regressions.
Doctors have no idea what it’s like to recover from a stroke. They should really lean more heavily on patients with lived experiences to guide their recovery timeline, rehab etc.
On Friday my initial neurologist said you see most results in 6 weeks post stroke (true), and all recovery by 6 months (completely wrong).
I said ‘I saw significant recovery at one year, then more after that..’
‘Oh it’s maybe because you’re young’
I didn’t argue but I know for sure older people than me on this forum seen substantial improvements a year +
Agreed @matt_d13 but I want stroke survivors to never give up and be disheartened,progress can and will be made,negativity breeds negativity.and as the wonderful @Bobbi says keep on keeping on,onwards and upwards we go.if you told me 4 years ago I’d be eating normally I wouldn’t have necessarily believed you but thanks to a particular SALT appreciating that I had the mental capacity to decide for myself,I’m eating with acknowledgement of the risk -choking,aspiration lung infection etc.
I love the sentiment of your post and I agree wholeheartedly, but I keep seeing the opposite reaction/approach. I am thinking very few people fall into the Michelle/Bobbi/Pando/Rupert stroke survivors.
Far too many listen to and believe what their doctors/consultants tell them and sadly most of (doctors/consultants) them talk total and utter Sandras (Bullocks)!!
This is not an exception - it’s the norm and if matt wasn’t the person he is, he too would have given up after six months.
Please carry on bangin’ the drum Michelle - sooner or later people will start listening.
That particular SaLT is a gold nugget - there are very few of them and you were one of the lucky ones who found them or they found you.
You have to remember that before anything else a professional has to cover his/her arse.
As we slowly sink into the blame culture we need to realise there is truth but it is not always presented in an easy to recognise form.
I’m old school and my decisions have been made, in the main, by myself. When things went awry I had myself or my perception of things to blame and I needed to work at getting it right next time.
It is easy but useless to expect others to clear up your mess, they too have messes to deal with. Yes we can, when we are able, help one another but in my book an adult is generally setting their own goals and choosing their path through it all.
We can hear advice and sometimes that is advisable but we ourselves decide what is right.
And this is why you do not get the whole picture.
Since the blame culture or suing culture came about, no doctor is ever going to tell you you will survive the stroke or make a full recover when directly asked the question. Because if they said, yes, of course you will make a full recovery and then you don’t they’ll get their ass sued.
Doctors will not get involved.
Post-stroke Mum’s GP refused to assess Mum’s mental capacity because she said her conclusion could be challenged at a future date if myself and my sister had a disagreement about Mum’s care needs. It took us 9 months to a year, just to het the GP to even make a referral for the mental health clinic to assess Mum - they (GP practice) were so fearful.
This is why in my view the NHS is in trouble. Doctors can’t do things for fear of being taken to court. So all they say is - well you know what they say. They sit on the fence and you as the survivor are stuffed. You want them to say, yes you will walk again, but they won’t say it and so you think they are saying you won’t again (by default) and so you are trapped in a vicious circle.
The Matt’s, Bobbi’s and Michelle’s of this world will do what they have to but others will listen to the experts who aren’t really telling them anything (because they are not allowed to).
You also get the other end where some doctors will think and say you (family/patient) have unrealistic expectations when you tell them “I will walk again, you watch !”. These doctors are in my view the ones who studied parrot fashion, passed their exams and became doctors without having a clue as to what medicine is all about.
All you have read above, is purely my own personal views and in no way is it to be taken as advice, recommendation or such like. It is just the ranting of a mad fool who has not enough time on his hands yet finds ways to waste it
You are mistaken. I have had, on occasion, very apposite advice given carefully out of earshot of anyone else.
I was told after I had ended up on the floor, by a doctor checking me over and when I was back on my bed, something I will never forget, repeat often, but would never say which doctor and where.
The doctor advised that an occasional episode on the floor was an indication that progress was occurring and implying that, indeed, a decent recovery would involve some risk taking.
Conversely being ‘totally safe’ would likely have a negative effect on betterment.
Much of these ‘pearls of wisdom’ are just common sense which, sometimes it seems, has to be avoided at all costs.
Blame me, blame the dog, but don’t blame the professional who is frantically trying to protect reputation, position and whatever else appears worthy of saving.
Thank you @Bobbi and @ManjiB this is a very valuable discussion that reminds us we are the makers of our own destiny and the so-called ‘experts’ are nonetheless human trying to cover their derier.
Hey Bobbi - Thank you for sharing your experience.
Firstly if I am mistaken, it will not be the first time and thank you for pointing that out
I am going to suggest what you described is an exception rather than the rule and as such, you and anyone receiving such advice / support/ encouragement are lucky - extremely lucky. This has absolutely not been our experience and so I can only go by that and by my understanding/interpretation/extrapolation of that. As such I stand by my views.
Just so that I can get a better understanding of how lucky or otherwise you might have been it would help me to put things into perspective if you could tell me (without compromising anyone)
When this comment was made - i.e. 20 /30 years ago when things were not politically correct and there was no blame culture or recently when political correctness has gone mad and blame culture is rife.
Who the doctor/consultant was, specifically was this person an experienced person, possibly a maverick type who was willing to take “risks” by going against employer policy.
Unless I am misunderstanding this, you have actually proved my point when you say
Key being
carefully out of earshot of anyone else.
This is effectively a private message and one that he/she is sharing with you in confidence and at risk of getting into trouble with his/her bosses. This is advise only for you.
Btw - when were you given this advice?
The advice was only given to you because you being a maverick had already “gone against” the flow and done something that they would not suggest to you had you not done it.
In conclusion, your experience is almost a one-off, never to be repeated. I don’t believe that advice is offered to anyone and may not have been offered to anyone before or since it was offered to you.
If I am wrong and mistaken, so be it.
As humans trying to cover their derrier when are you ever going to get the advice that would benefit you? They simply won’t take any risk. They don’t even want my Mum to go to hospital because they don’t want the “demise on their hands”.
Anyone getting the advice that I am talking about is very lucky or I am completely mad for expecting it (and not receiving).
It happened about 4 years ago. The doctor was no maverick, on the contrary a caring and concerned individual who was making sure I was okay after my descent to the floor.
Perhaps as I wan’t challenging, just appreciative of his attention, I elicited a more forthright and honest comment..
I think attitude can colour communication. A response is often tempered by one’s own manners and demeanour.
In this day and age, in a sue or be sued world, no interchange is clear of uncertainty.
I would go a little further and tell you that in general I have found people wherever and at whatever rank to be reasonable and willing to ‘get along’. However, I won’t deny it, there are those whom it is a pleasure to be away from.
I think @Rups keeping in mind the law concerning public spaces you are right and indeed one must keep a sense of decorum.
addendum
It has occurred to me since writing the above that these remarks were aimed at the person who had the stroke (myself, when I was overwhelmed and frightened by the experience) and talking to a carer, in contrast, he would stress that he was not advocating risk taking as a road to recovery.
Communication is such a finely tuned activity that it is easy to slip into an erroneous direction without having any such intention.
