Increasing numbness/heavy limbs

Anyone got any thoughts on what might be happening here? It’s long - I can’t seem to do short these days - but detail can help provide context, I hope. It’s also helpful (for me😆) writing it all down.

I’m 2yrs 2mths post stroke and my left arm has been getting progressively heavier over the last 6mths or so. My left leg is also affected to a lesser degree. Both limbs have also increased in numbness which adds to the heavy feeling. The shoulder feels tight but has pretty much full range of motion so maybe the tightness is sensation related although my OT doesn’t think so. I’d been seeing a private PT since the beginning of the year but because of the arm issues, she felt an OT would be more helpful at this stage. I’ve now had 3 sessions with the OT. Her observation is that the nervous system on my stroke side never shuts down - ie it never relaxes. I’ve noticed that I appear to feel emotion in the stroke arm, which tightens up periodically although I’m beginning to think it may be happening more in response to becoming mentally tired eg when chatting with a friend for more than 2 to 3 hours or if something has challenged me mentally or I become excitable🤣 The OT has asked me to halt all post stroke exercises until the end of the year and promised me I won’t regress. Of course, if I want to exercise, I can, but the idea is to not add stress by feeling I have to. So I’m continuing with the things I enjoy. I was having regular massages with an osteopath for a few months but with no benefits and often feeling worse afterwards. Her assessment was that my nervous system needed calming down and suggested I stop the massages and tried something like reflexology, which I did. I found it very relaxing and booked another session which I subsequently cancelled due to a family tragedy and I’ve not rebooked to date ( maybe I should🤔).

I haven’t had any anxiety issues since the stroke but pre stroke, life had been very stressful for many years so I guess my body spends a lot of time in fight or flight mode as I seem to be unable to relax unless I actually consciously do so. And I can only do that if I’m aware that I’m tense to begin with. The tenseness also causes issues with tightness in my neck and back on the affected side. My OT says I need to find an occupational balance’ between productivity, self-care and leisure. Most of my adult life has been centred around productivity with little time or focus on self-care and leisure. So under the guidance of the OT, I’ve been focusing on trying to get a balance. Pre stroke, I was very active much of the time but a lot of it was fuelled by stress and although I haven’t got the same stress anymore, I can still act as though I have so it’s about unlearning bad habits/patterns of behaviour. I find all this quite fascinating but in practice, quite hard to do. One of my exercises is music therapy. This is how it’s done: 1. Sit in armchair. 2.put pillow/cushions on lap. 3. Make sure I can feel contact with feet on the floor, bottom on seat, back against chair, head back against chair, arms on arm rests. 4. Listen to just one element of chosen song for the full length of the song. 5. Deep breath at the end. The object of all this is to increase sensory input. My brain has already grown the new pathways to my arm, which is about 95% functional, despite the heavy feeling, numbness tightness, with pins and needles predominately in the hand. This time last year, the pins and needles had dwindled to something less bothersome but then started increasing in line with tightness in the forearm and now the upper arm. Although this stroke arm feels nothing like my unaffected arm, it still functions almost as well. Sensation wise, the hand feels like I’m wearing a moderately thick glove. And there is also the sensation of dental anaesthesia in the face from my left eye to mouth which is increased at the moment but historically changes from mild to moderate from time to time.

I suspect this phase of recovery is going to be long and maybe arduous. It’s getting me down a bit because it feels like a set back. I’ve not really experienced a real set back until now for which I’m grateful. I’ve had times over the last few months where I’m walking like I used to, for short distances, and the strides feel more fluid and normal. A few weeks ago, I had 4 or 5 much better days on the trot and had that now familiar feeling (for me) that I’m going to be ok. However, the past week has been my worst in terms of pain and discomfort since the stroke and I don’t know why or whether there is something I’m doing that triggers it. It’s coincided with the last OT session so is it possible my nervous system is being irritated in some way other than stress :woman_shrugging:t2: Now I’m limping and can feel my good leg compensating. On a positive front, I’m also becoming more aware of when I’m tensed up, which seems to be most of the time. There are times, when I’m feeling rough, that I push myself to exercise more and to do more generally, although it won’t be anything like what I could achieve pre stroke. Now I’m wondering why I do that and whether I’m subconsciously perceiving feeling rough with being stressed and using activity as a coping mechanism :woman_shrugging:t2: Should I rest or be active at those times? Am I overthinking and complicating everything? If you’ve managed to read this far, I thank you. And if you have -
Anyone got any thoughts/advice or can relate to any of this?

Trace

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Hi Trace - I have read your post and not being a stroke survivor I cannot share any personal experience. I can offer some generic advice which may or not be appropriate :frowning:

Firstly, I think you absolutely should resume the reflexology and see if it continues to provide the relaxation it did when you first tried it.

Secondly, perhaps the increasing numbness / heavy limbs is you becoming more aware of these limbs? E.g. if there was some paralysis there before? Also, exercise, especially energetic will likely have impact on muscle mass?

Third and final thought re tingling - have you had blood tests done recently to see if all is balanced. Sometimes deficiencies of vitamins and minerals can have these effects e.g. B12 deficiency can cause tingling, needs and pins.

I expect this is just the next phase of your stroke recovery and not having been here before it might be something you think about more than you might otherwise?

I am sure some better advice is on its way as it always is on this forum, but I thought I’d at least offer you something to think about :slight_smile:

Take care.
:pray:

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Hello @Trace57

Right, I can paint a picture of my “journey” albeit the right side, if you like?

Post-stroke over 3 years ago, I couldn’t feel my right side at all. Not numbness, no pain, it’s was like it was dead. I was discharged from the hospital using my right leg to hobble myself about, but it was still dead.

Fast forward 3 years and I feel something from my leg, but it started with numbness, and then pain (it wasn’t pain, but my brain was still routing a new pathway), and then numbness again, and then heavy weighted limbs but no feeling………right now, it a rhythmic circle for me - numbness, pain, heavy, repeat.

But, I use my leg a lot more despite I have no feeling in it. The other day I found out the muscle, right behind the knee cap, started to work but no feeling, just seeing it. It’s very weak but something to focus on.

Whereas, my right arm is still dead………until I went to sleep that is. When I’m asleep it started to dance the fandango. Who knew!

M

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@Trace57
Wow you have so many issued to address.
It appears you have been shoved from pillar to post and no one is coming up with the results you have hoped for. I am also a stroke survivor, but I cannot comment on any of your issues as I did nor suffer them. It appesrs tou would be better on concentrating on one issue at a time and not to run your life like you did port stroke. before my stroke I was 100 miles an hour person. I wanted to be like that again but I was stopping my recovery. Now I have changed my mind det thanks to the help from this Forum and I am slowly now making progress. Also remember all these people you have gone to, they are just giving you an opinion from a text book because they do not have the answer for you. Good luck for the future, sending :smiling_face_with_three_hearts:positive vibes :four_leaf_clover: :folded_hands:

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You always have good insight and advice to give @ManjiB :heart:
Thank you for your response.

I agree, another reflexology session has to be worth a try and if it has the same effects as last time, I should consider making it a regular therapy.

Your thoughts re the numbness were helpful. As I was writing that post, I had a dialogue going on in my head, questioning whether the numbness is really increasing or whether it was more of an awakening to more sensation. Right after the stroke, I was paralysed from my arm to leg. The PT’s had me standing that same evening, supported, of course. I remember having pins and needles start in the leg around the same time. But I didn’t even know I had an arm for a few weeks and neither did I miss it :rofl: The PT’s were constantly reminding me to look at where it was, which was always flopped and hanging over the side of the chair. These days, I have the OT reminding me to relax that shoulder, because it’s always hiked up where I’m unaware that I’m tense :roll_eyes: Anyway, my brain started to make the connection and with lots of sensory reeducation, I’d got to the point where I was able to use a knife and fork by the time I was discharged after 2mths in rehab. The arm has remained numb but has also gained considerable positive and normal sensation, so I can feel things like light touch, pressure, pin pricks etc. I’m sure the numbness contributes to the feeling of heaviness because the arm feels swollen, although it isn’t, of course! I’ve also noticed over the last few months that the numbness appears to intensify when I’ve been out walking for a while and now I’m thinking that is most likely because I’m getting tired. So the perception of numbness increasing is most likely flawed. In reality, I’m probably becoming more aware of what my body is feeling?

I’ve not had any blood tests done since Oct 23 when the results were fine. I should book one in, I suppose. Apart from not having much of an appetite, my diet is very good and I know I get all the nutrients I need but I’m aware that older people can have problems absorbing Vit B12. Plus the BP med I’m on can deplete minerals but I account for that through diet. I’ve considered this in relation to the pins and needles but as they are happening on the stroke side only, I doubt it’s vitamin deficiency, especially as I’ve got no other symptoms. In fact, I have to keep reminding my Mum that I’m not ill and actually feel very well on my unaffected side :laughing:

Finally, I think you’re right about this being the next phase of recovery and I shall just go with the flow and get on with it, however unpleasant it is! This too, shall pass😁

Thank you again for replying. I went to bed last night feeling much more positive after I’d read it. Oftentimes, we just need a little bit of reassurance and encouragement.

Have a blessed day.

Trace

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@Trace57

Well, I’m always telling people we are not alone. There are ups and there are downs. We are in it for the long haul. blah, blah, blah.

You seem to have it all weighed up and are coping having learnt many of the lessons that stroke and its after effects teach.

You’ve also found what I discovered, talking about it, writing about it, puts it into perspective and provides those so elusive answers we all seek.

I’m going through a bad patch right now.
Quite probably a result of pushing on and trying to do too much.

Is this the issue? Are those people who encounter stroke the driven, those who don’t know when or how to ease down?

Is this the answer, the big lesson? Do we just need to learn how to chill out?

Do I need to stop and take a break?

NOT

keep on keepin on

INSTEAD

stop have a brew, smell the roses
:heart:

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Thank you for that @MattJC . I really appreciate you taking the time to reply. I know you’ve had/ are having a rough time - I’ve read some of your posts and remember your first one.

What you’re experiencing is very helpful to me in terms of trying to understand what’s happening and I’m feeling less concerned about it now. I have to keep reminding myself the numbness is coming from the brain and not damaged nerves (which my brain gets confused about) and that it’ll hopefully sort itself out in time. My OT told me sensation is always the last thing to return if it was affected by stroke. Also, my problems pale into insignificance compared to what you’re dealing with (I know, it’s all relative, but still…). Positive news that something is happening with your leg - proof that it’s not dead and revival could be happening, sooner rather than later - you’ve already had to wait too long. Keep using that leg! As for your arm - isn’t it interesting how it behaves when you’re asleep :thinking:. Does it wake you up or has your wife told you? That arm can’t be dead because your brain must be communicating with it when you’re asleep. I wonder if it’s also connected to dreaming? Fascinating.

Thanks again for replying.
I hope today is a “better” day for you.

Trace

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Hey Trace - I appreciate your comments. I love sharing my thoughts and experiences and I leave it to the receiver whether to take it on board or not. It’s a personal choice and we often have differences of opinion and beliefs etc.

For almost as long as I can remember, in my adult life, I have always mentored friends and work colleagues. I have also been approached by managers for my views on things and so I believe I have mentored some of my managers. It’s something that comes naturally to me and I know that sometimes what I offer is hard to take. This is sometimes because, I am a “do as I say and not do as I do” and so those receiving my advice question why they should do it if I am not doing it myself. What is missed from this is that I have assessed the situation and offering advice on what is best for you in your situation and it does not mean I have to do it. This goes back to us all being different.

Anyway, I am pleased you were able to get to bed in a positive frame of mind and I do believe you have now reached the next phase of your recovery. You will soon understand what is going on and take the necessary actions.

If I were you, I would still take the blood test just so you know where you stand. Sometimes we look OK on the outside but there is stuff going on inside and oftentimes it takes time to be noticed by which time it is a little late, though ultimately, it is never too late :slight_smile:

You take care.

:pray:

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Sorry to hear this Bobbi - I think you may have been overdoing it a little, but that’s OK as long as you realise it and take a break.

How about some therapy in the form of cooking? Some nice cakes or warming soup?

But certainly a nice cuppa will help :slight_smile:

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Believe me @IreneFC , there’s no way I could run my life like I did pre stroke🤣. I’d like to be able to, though, in some ways. The last 2 years have been a gradual coming to terms with having been forced to slow down. If I didn’t have all these sensory issues, I’d probably be running riot and causing myself more damage by now so in one way, they’re an unwanted blessing.

I’m not 100% convinced by what the OT is saying about my nervous system but I’m willing to consider it and do some work to see if it yields any results. I asked her if I needed to see a neurologist and she advised against it, saying I would be told the sensory issues are the after effects of stroke and therefore ‘written off’ and she didn’t want that to happen to me. She believes I can be ‘fixed’ and so do I, although she’s reminded me that the gold standard is not how I was pre stroke - we’re making a new one!

Unfortunately, my expectation of a quick recovery came from PT, OT’s and other medical professionals who were quick to say things along those lines because I recovered so much in the 2 mths I was in rehab. But once all that sensory stuff started getting in the way, it’s become a different story. Compared to this time last year, I’ve achieved a lot. I drive on my own, go out on my own, visit friends, go shopping, take myself to appointments etc. I can do probably 90% or more of what I previously did, albeit at a slower rate. The difference is that I have to push myself to do it because I feel so rubbish most of the time. And I’m still learning to pace myself as overdoing things comes easily. But I had an epiphany - if I want to have a life, I need to get on with living it even if it’s uncomfortable much of the time. Many people with huge limitations live great lives so I have no excuse!!

Have a great day😁

Trace

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Your welcome. Ref my arm, what’s interesting is I don’t know whether it wakes me up, or waking up slowly and it’s still boogieing until i starred at “him” and he’s slowly gone back to bed……

But, I do not dream anymore. One of those stroke-symptoms I guess.

:cry:

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Awww @Bobbi. Sorry you’re going through a bad patch. Be kind to yourself and rest up, or do something you enjoy, gently. Maybe you have overdone things - it’s so easy to do. I’m learning that taking breaks are important. Maybe some of us havent spent enough time ‘chilling’ and that’s why we ended up here :woman_shrugging:t2: I know I haven’t until now but in some weird way, I quite enjoy not needing an excuse anymore to take a day off or to not do something I don’t want to do but have felt obliged to do.

I was sitting in the garden a couple of weeks ago, lapping up the sun with my bare feet grounded on the grass, looking around at what needed to be done. For the past 25 years or so, I’ve been clearing the bank next to our house. It goes on for miles but every year, I’d get up there and clear around 80ft of it, because the growth is dense and blocks out the sun. I was up there with a chainsaw a few years back, getting rid of as many trees as I could, although many of them are too big to fell so I’d lop the lower branches instead. It was so lovely to get the sun back in the garden and to have more light in the house. Since the stroke, I’ve not been able to get up there. But I want to :laughing:. So I’m not writing it off - yet.


Then my eyes wandered to the 4ft high weeds next to our redundant greenhouse and the compost bin standing in the way of me getting to them. I thought, “why not?” So I got what I needed from the shed, removed the loose stuff from out of the compost bin and lifted the bin up and over the solid mass of part formed compost in the bottom and placed it where I wanted it. Then I refilled the bin using a dustpan - the weight of a shovel would be too tiring - and turned my attention to getting rid of those big weeds. Afterwards, I emptied 10 heavy-ish plant pots.


It took me 2.5hrs to do everything and I had 3 short 10 min breaks in between. I thought about tidying the greenhouse but by then, my body was shot. I was feeling great from the exercise and sense of achievement. I probably paid for it the next day although I don’t remember. But sometimes, we just have to see if we can still do these things.

Hope you’re feeling better very soon x

Trace

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Maybe you need to look at ‘him’ when he’s asleep and see if you can will him to wake up😊

Sad you no longer dream. My dreams have always been a bit mad but since the stroke, they can be a bit too intense and sometimes I have to wake myself up😆

Trace

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@Manj Your way of communicating and caring is a gift. That’s how I see it, anyway😁

Yes, you’re right about the blood test. I should just get on with it :syringe::drop_of_blood::flushed_face:

Trace

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@Trace57 i think your OT may have a point about giving physio a rest for a while. I am wondering whether some of your issues are because you are trying too hard (in a good way) and have caused fatigue / decompensation. Fatigue isn’t just about tiredness it can come out in many ways.

I agree re the reflexology. If it helped give it another try & also get your bloods checked. It probably isn’t but maybe there is another cause. Worth ruling out.

I think we can put a lot of pressure on ourselves to keep going regardless and that isn’t always the best thing. It’s about finding that balance. That is different for everyone.

Maybe taking a step back and not over thinking / doing things for a while is the way forward.

Best wishes

Ann

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Thank you @Mrs5K. After I’d made that post, I saw something you’d posted elsewhere with a link to ‘decompensation’ so I had a read. It makes sense. The thing is, though, there are days where it feels like I don’t do very much at all, aside from the usual house chores. How much is too much and how much is too little :woman_shrugging:t2: I seem to have problems gauging that. If I’m going out, I’ll get ready but will usually need a rest before actually leaving the house. I wake raring to go most days, but not long after I get up, my body starts to protest. It’s so disappointing :laughing: On the other hand, although I’m not old, I’ll be 68 in a few months so I’m slowing down anyway. My Mum turned 87 today and she still walks for miles, has a great social life and is totally independent, with no health issues worth mentioning. She takes one low dose pill a day for blood pressure and nothing else. Naively, I always believed I’d be blessed with the same good health :roll_eyes:

Maybe I am putting too much pressure on myself. I know it sounds silly, but years ago when I was just a kid, my lovely, lovely nan, bless her, called me lazy and I’ve never forgotten it. It was probably over something mundane like not helping to wash up or tidy my room but after that, I resolved to always be busy doing something so no-one would accuse me of being lazy again😂 She also called me a fairy elephant, so I tried my best to become light footed😂
Getting on and enjoying what’s left of this life has to be the way forward😊

Trace

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How much is too much is a very good question. I, like you, have yet to get this right. I’m always overdoing it then getting told off by my husband when I’m sat on the sofa complaining about feeling rubbish yet again.

It’s important to remember that resting after a Stroke isn’t being lazy it is vital so that you can get through the rest of the day. It is also important not to overdo it on the days when you feel much brighter too as that can impact later down the line.

Decompensation is one of those things I wish the medics had explained to me as it would have saved a couple of long waits in A&E. I try not to worry so much now when I feel really rough and just rest until it passes.

Age does play a part in things too. I wonder if having a long term illness speeds it along a little so we get frailer(not really the right word but can’t think of it right now) a little earlier than we perhaps might have done. Your mum sounds like my mum. She is 78 and very much like a spring chicken. Apart from breaking her hip 2 years ago she has never really been ill and even after breaking her hip she was back out walking in a few weeks and now you’d never know she has an artificial hip. I can only dream of that right now.

I had to chuckle at your fairy elephant. It conjured up an image which made me laugh. Your nan sounds like she spoke her mind……a bit like mine although I didn’t hear it often as she lived in Australia. :grin:.

Be kind to yourself and take things a bit easier for a while. You will probably feel all the better for it and that in turn will help you do all those things you want to.

Ann

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@Bobbi sorry to hear you’re going through a bad patch . It happens to the best of us. Rest up & take it easy for a bit and hopefully you’ll be back to your sunny self soon.

Ann x

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@Mrs5K

I’m okay, Will survive. An old injury decided I was too comfortable. It isn’t agony just uncomfortable. I hate pain killers, don’t need them. I’ll be back to normal and making a nuisance of myself soon enough.

I’m off to watch telly with Hilary and probably have a snooze.

take care

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Grrrrr tell your old injury to leave you in peace. Doesn’t it know you have enough to deal with right now :blush: I hope it settles for you quickly and we look forward to having you back making mischief very soon.

Look after yourself.

Ann

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